Perspectives on Korean-American Immigration As Told by Maryanne Kim
December 8, 2023
Maryanne Kim
Interviewee: Maryanne Kim
Interviewer: Benjamin Spragg
Interviewee Biography and Interview Synopsis:
This interview is with Maryanne Kim, a 48-year-old Korean-American woman living in
Lake Mary, Florida. Maryanne works in finance, and has a husband with whom she has raised a
19-year-old daughter and a 22-year-old son. Maryanne describes her childhood memories in
Korea, her eventual movement to the United States, her identity as a Korean immigrant, and her
and her family’s place in Korean-American culture, all in vivid detail. She discusses her
activities, family customs, and traditions from her Korean childhood, how she met her husband
and created her family, and how she feels she compares to other Korean Americans she has
become associated with. Her experiences allow a listener to better understand and generalize
Korean childhood and culture, and how Korean-Americans feel about various aspects of
American life and acclimatization, taking into account both the positive and negative effects of
American culture on migrant Koreans. This interview was conducted virtually, over Zoom, due
to the long distance between Colby’s campus and Maryanne’s home near Orlando, FL.
This interview was conducted by Ben Spragg, a second year History Major at Colby
College who is interested in exploring a variety of histories (such as the history of the Korean
Peninsula) before deciding on a concentration related to his course of study.
Full Interview recording:
Full Interview Transcript:
Ben: My name is Ben Spragg. Today is October 27, 2023. I’m interviewing Maryanne Kim through Zoom for the Colby College Korean Oral History Project. Maryanne, do you agree to grant the college permission to archive and publish this interview for educational purposes?
Maryanne: Sure.
Ben: Perfect, thank you so much. Well, to start off, how are you today?
Maryanne: Good, how are you?
Ben: Doing really well, really excited to talk to you and get this interview started. First of all, for you, what does a normal typical day’s schedule look like? How do you spend your day?
Maryanne: I get up the morning, and then I go run a short run, like two miles. Then I get my smoothie and I go to work. I’m in finance. Then after work, I’ll come home a little early. I usually am kind of flexible with my work. I come home to prepare dinner for my family. Then after, around 6 or – actually, around 7. Then I’ll work a little bit more at home. Then that’s pretty much my day during the week. Then on Friday, Saturday, Sunday, I have the days off from work.
Ben: What do you like to do during those days off? Do you do things that are leisurely and fun for you that you’d like to share for us?
Maryanne: Yeah, sure. My husband and I are doing pottery; so we go to the pottery studio two days out of the week. On the weekends, on Saturday and Sunday, we go to the pottery studio. Then on Sundays, we do a long run on the trail. We’ll just go out to eat right after we clean up. We take a shower. Then we’ll head to the studio. Then we’ll just hang out and spend our Sundays like that, most of our Sundays. Then on Saturdays, we go to church. Then we’ll have a little lunch and then go to the pottery studio. That’s how our weekends go by so fast.
Ben: Awesome. How do you spend time with your children? How do you engage with them throughout the course of the week?
Maryanne: I used to homeschool my kids. I gave my 24 hours, 24/7 with my kids. We did a lot of field trips. We did a lot of things. They would do group classes one or two days out of the week. I did that while they were younger. Then, as soon as they both turned 16, they were – started to drive, so they’re on their own. My son would just go to the gym in the morning and then go to school in the afternoon and – not in the afternoon, he’ll go to school for a few classes, because he’s a junior and he’s in a college program.
Then after that, he will just – he has a part-time job. He’ll go to work or – so he’s kind of on his own. He’s not always home for dinner because dinner is very important in our family. When our kids were younger, we would always have dinner together. That has kind of ended. My daughter is now in college. She’s a sophomore. Yeah, things are not like it used to be. Everyone’s very in their own things.
Ben: Yeah, understood. Well, the reason I asked about your kids – and I’ll get to the parallels between your kids and you in a second. I’d like to bring up the theme of childhood and specifically your childhood. From the survey I sent you, it’s my understanding that you spent your early years in Korea.
Maryanne: Yes, I spent 12 years, yeah, in Korea.
Ben: Let’s take it to the very beginning. Can you share some of your earliest memories from your childhood in Korea? What stands out to you the most?
Maryanne: I grew up in Korea when it was very fast developing. Korea was an underdeveloped country and they went through the Korean War in the ‘50s. They were just coming out of that. At that time, I don’t remember. As an adult, now that I know a little bit of the history of Korea, that in the ‘60s and ‘70s, the President Park, Chung-Hee Park, he had helped Korea, especially Seoul, the capital city, to develop very fast. Then it became more of a developing country.
I lived around a time when our country was developing very fast, very rapidly. My last memory of Korea when I was immigrated to America, that every – the last two years of my life was all about Olympics. They were advertising Olympics. They were trying to get the city ready for Olympics. We had Asian Olympics in 1986, a year before I was leaving Korea. Then a year after I left Korea, they were getting ready for 1988 Korean Olympics.
That was the biggest memory of me – of Korea, is that they were pushing Olympics and they were just cleaning up everything, getting ready – getting the country ready for Olympics. That stands out in my memory.
Ben: Yeah.
Maryanne: Mm-hmm.
Ben: Do you think that that sense of strong national pride and representation was a large part of your childhood throughout it as a Korean?
Maryanne: Yeah, we took very strong pride in it. They reinforced that in our educational system. I don’t know. It was very political. I think it was a lot of push in our education system about how we should take pride to be South Korean, and how we should not – North Korea was really bad; we’re lucky to be in South Korea.
There were a lot of restrictions, also. At the time, I guess, they were trying to restrict or control the population. I remember we were making posters to have just one or two kids in the family or something. I don’t remember really well. I guess they were trying to limit size of the family, and that family had too many kids or something like that.I recall that. That’s an issue in Korea right now. Then that rang a bell. Like oh, yeah, I think we used to make posters and were being educated not to have too many children. That was the propaganda at the time.
I don’t know how that became in our conversation, but I just remember – yeah, oh, in school, yeah, in school system, they always talked about the division, how North Korea is bad and then how South Korea is such a good country. They were kind of brainwashing – which is true, too, and how we should take pride to be South Koreans. I don’t know if you’d use the word brainwashing, but they taught us to be very proud to be Koreans. I guess in any country, I guess we do that in our education system, to take your pride.
Ben: Definitely.
Maryanne: Yeah.
Ben: Yeah, that’s all great. As it relates to the educational system and the cultural and societal norms in Korea during your childhood, how did that shape your specific upbringing and values, if at all?
Maryanne: Actually, I think at the time that I was living in Korea, in the ‘70s and early ‘80s, is that I think Korea was very – I don’t know what’s the proper word, but they weren’t internationally well known. I don’t think they had a good relationship with countries, other countries. There were a lot of restrictions in importing. Oh, I remember in school, we were not allowed to wear anything that’s not made in Korea.
Sometimes, teachers will randomly check what kind of shoes you’re wearing, what kind of clothes you’re wearing. If you’re using supplies, or school supplies, or wearing clothes from outside of Korea, like it was made in USA, you would get in trouble. They’d say, “We can’t wear this to school anymore.” It might sound a little funny, but they were trying to focus about – because it’s that time where Korea was industrially and economically growing so fast. I think all the focus went to that. Even our educational system, I think they reinforced that as well. I remember getting in trouble wearing a nice wool jacket that I got from my aunt who lived in America. My mom had visited my – her sister. Then she brought back all these clothes from America. Then the teacher would be like serving and say “Hey, is anyone wearing anything that’s made in USA?” Then I was [00:10:13] raised my hand. I got myself in trouble. She’s like, “Can’t wear that jacket to school any longer.”
Yeah, it’s not like that anymore in Korea. I think there were a lot of restrictions, and we couldn’t – we did not have a good relationship with Japan because Korea was under the invasion of Japan. A lot of the older generation did not like Japanese. We weren’t allowed to bring in – use Japanese products, that kind of thing. Yeah, I remember that kind of stuff, mm-hmm.
Ben: During that part of your childhood, during that Japanese invasion, how did that manifest itself into your everyday life? Is there a discernible difference from before and after?
Maryanne: I don’t have anything against Japanese because I didn’t grow up in the era. It’s not like all the Japanese people are like that, but there’s still animosity between Korea and Japan, still now. I didn’t even know, but just not too long ago, maybe within 10 or 15 years, maybe even less than that. I’m not sure, but the Korean country allowed Japanese cars to be imported to Korea because we don’t – we’d see Mercedes, BMW, all American cars, Fords, Chrysler, Audi.
We’d see all kinds of these imported cars in Korea, but I never saw Japanese car. There was a ban on imports on cars, because we did have other stuff that are Japanese products. Yeah, I think now they’re allowed Japanese cars to be imported in Korea. There’s still animosity. We were – yeah, we learned – I remember learning stuff like that, too, in – growing up in Korea, that we’re not to like Japanese culture and things like that.
Ben: Did you learn that formally through the education system like you were talking about, or did you learn that informally through the mentors and people around you who maybe didn’t necessarily have authority like a teacher would but still influenced you in some way?
Maryanne: Yeah, it’s not in textbook or anything because they claim that one of the island, Dokdo, is their island. I know that still, they’re fighting. They’re still fighting for that, because it’s definitely our – it belongs to South Korea, but they still claim that that’s their land. I know that in textbooks, that’s still a – it’s a controversial issue. Yeah, the teachers will give their stories about their experience but never in textbook to hate Japanese or anything like that.
Ben: What were some of those experiences from your teachers, if you can remember?
Maryanne: I don’t remember where I got the influence, but I just know that a lot of adults did not like Japanese. They would talk bad about – not down upon Japanese people, I think, but it was never formally I was educated on it, or – yeah, I can’t recall. There’s still animosity with Japanese culture and Japanese – yeah, Japan and Korea still exist until this day.
Ben: During your childhood in Korea, were there a significant amount of Japanese people living near or around you? Or was it just from the outside looking in?
Maryanne: My parents did not have that kind of discrimination against Japanese because my dad spoke Japanese fluently and he did a lot of business in Japan. He’ll go visit Japan a lot. We did not have anything, but – and he had friends who were Korean Japanese. Then their kids will come and stay with us for a long time because they wanted to go to school in Korea. They will stay with us. I remember having a college student living with us for a semester because she wanted to learn Korean at a Korean college.
Yeah, I did not get that influence from my parents or my family, because we’re – my grandma on my mom’s side also spoke fluent Japanese. A lot of my mom’s aunts, they were educated in Japan. They all went abroad and studied there, too. Then in Korea, there is people who are for the Japanese and there’s a group of people, they’re against Japanese. That’s still controversial here. That’s still going on to this day.
Ben: You bringing up your family members is a perfect segue into my next question or several questions relating to elements of family, especially during your childhood. I know that you mentioned earlier the importance of family dinners to you. For things such as that, what were some significant traditions or practices that Koreans at the time, or your family specifically, engaged in? How do you remember that as it pertains to your childhood?
Maryanne: Meals is very important in Korean families because there were scarcity of food when our parents’ generation, and even older generation, because they went through Korean War. Even our his and byes are about – or how are yous, greetings, are like, “Hey, did you have a – did you eat?” That’s how we say, “How are you?” It’s like, “Did you eat? Did you have dinner? Did you have lunch?”
That’s how we still converse. My mother-in-law, who’s in her 80s, will always ask my kids, “Hey, did you have –” as soon as she calls me, if it’s dinnertime, she’s like, “Hey, did you have dinner?” That’s her way of saying, “How are you?” That’s very typical of Korean people, is their greeting is all about food. Food is very important. We always ate breakfast together as a family and then dinner also as a family. I tried to keep that tradition here when my kids were younger.
Yeah, and then also the proper culture etiquette is that when your father sits down, if he’s the oldest at the table, he would pick up his silverware first and starts eating. Then the rest of the family can start eating. The father, if he’s the oldest – if there are grandparents, of course, they have to start eating first. Then the youngsters will follow. That is the Korean etiquette.
Ben: Yeah, that’s, again, perfect into my next question. How did your family dynamics and relationships with your relatives differ from or resemble the typical Korean family structure during your upbringing?
Maryanne: We were just a very ordinary Korean family. I don’t think we were any different than, yeah, other Korean families. Usually, those days, a lot of moms stayed home and then dad worked. The mom would raise the kids. Both my parents were educated. They all both went to university, Korean university, got education. I learned that people, they were born in the ‘60s – not ‘60s, ‘40s, not all people were educated.
Right now, living in America, Asians push education on their kids. Education is so important. A lot of people emigrated to America so that their kids can have better life and better education than they did back home. I know that it’s not just the Korean families that come here to have a better life for their children but other culture too, as well.
Because in Korea, a lot of parents make sacrifice so that their kids can go to a good college. That’s the goal of the parents when they have kids. It was very typical in our family as well, that we all went to four-year universities and minimum education. The fact that I learned that my mom’s generation, not everyone got four-year university, like bachelors; they didn’t earn a bachelor’s degree. It was very rare. My mom still stayed home and raised us, mm-hmm.
Ben: I guess my next theme will be the transition for you to the United States. First, what spurred that transition? What, if any, were the reasons for your family’s move to the United States?
Maryanne: I don’t clearly know, but from my assumption is that my sister’s – not my sister. My mom’s older sister, she came to America to study to become a pianist. She marries someone that had a green card, or a citizenship here, or something. Then she was able to invite her family to come to America. It was easy to move to America and get the visa or a green card.
My dad had that prepared just in case his business failed. He always had a backup to go to America. I know, from early on, that we might move to America. I remember my older brother always told us, “Oh, we might move to America, so you better start studying English,” and things like that. He’s five years older. He would say, “Oh, we might move to America one day.” I heard that since first grade, and I moved here end of – once I completed fifth grade. Yeah, I think my whole grade school life, I knew that one day, we’ll move to America.
Your question was why – so anyway, because of my aunt’s able to invite us to America, my older – her older brother moved to America. His whole family moved to America two years before we did. Then I guess my dad’s business wasn’t doing so well or something like that, so he wanted to – because he had a import/export business. He thought that maybe he would do it in America, so we moved 1987. We arrived in Chicago because my dad’s best friend was living in Chicago, so he – we came to Chicago.
Ben: When you transitioned to the United States, to Chicago, what, if any, challenges did you face as a Korean-American child in terms of language, culture, fitting in, anything you can remember about things like that?
Maryanne: When I came here, actually, my dad had a great idea. He said, “Okay, you know what?” I grew up in a family of four children, right? I’m the youngest. My sister’s the oldest, and then I have two brothers in between. He said, “You know what? Since you’re the girls, you guys stay back. Let us go first.” He took my mom and two brothers, came to America first. Then he wanted to get a house ready and get us business set up, and then he said he’ll come back and get my sister and I – my sister and me.
We were staying at my aunt’s house for two, three months until going to America. Found a place to live, and then he came out, and then he brought us to America. I had a very easy transition. My dad was – he bought a newly developing neighborhood. He bought a house in a newly developing neighborhood, so we were building our home at the time. The house that he purchased was being built, so we were renting a house nearby.
Luckily, my dad knew my mom’s cousin, who came to America, and she was in the real estate business. She was an agent. She found us a place to rent and to – so we were able to buy a house. It was really nice because I grew up in a apartment in Korea. In Korea, a apartment was very trendy at the time in the 70s because everyone lived in single-family homes. Then in the 70s or 60s even, the president, Chung-hee Park, he started developing the south of Han River, which is [00:24:41], which became – the song became very popular a few years ago.
The [00:24:45] was being developed in the 70s, and they started building high rise buildings and apartments because most of the population in Seoul lived in [00:24:57], which means it’s the north of the Han River. They started developing the [00:25:04], which is the south of Han River. My dad made investment of a apartment that was being built, and I was born there. I grew up in a very – mostly westernized setting. We had our own – I hear you have to use the – there are even share bathrooms and just single-family homes. Yeah, I heard stuff like that, but I grew up where we had our own bathroom, we had our own shower, we had our own bathtub. I remember that was not really common back then.
For me, the transition was easy, the living-wise because I was already living like a westernized lifestyle since I was born. My brothers, because they came a little earlier than me, they would always tell me, “Oh, [00:26:07]. You take shower in the morning before you go to school.” They told me about putting mousse in my hair. They’d tell me, like, few words to say and – so the transition for me was easy. When I first arrived in Chicago, and my parents put me in a school where there was a bilingual class – because there were a lot of, I guess, newly immigrated Korean families in that district.
There were Korean teachers for the students that just that just came from Korea to ease the transition going into the regular classes. I took my classes in the bilingual classroom for first couple of years. I would only go into the regular class with the kids only in math, in art, music, or just those kind of thing that doesn’t require a lot of reading. I would learn history, and grammar, reading with the Korean teachers. That was very rare to have that kind of system in those school districts, but I guess there were a lot of Korean families that they offer a special program like that.
Ben: How culturally did you fit in with your fellow American classmates at the time? When do you feel like, if at all, you fully ingrained yourself in American culture during your school days in Chicago?
Maryanne: I can’t say I was ever fully ingrained with American culture in school system. It’s because of that bilingual system, I already had five Korean friends that were in my situation that had immigrated. I only hung out with what’s comfortable for me, so I only hung out with the Korean. That’s how it was in middle school, too. I had few friends who were non-Koreans, but I wasn’t allowed to sleep over, or, say, getting invited to parties. I wasn’t allowed. Both my parents were working and busy. They weren’t always available to take me to a friend’s house. Yeah, I didn’t really have friends outside of my Korean-American circle.
Ben: During that, if at all, were there any instances of cultural identity crises that you experienced, or would you say that the transition to the culture was fairly uneventful because you stuck that certain circle?
Maryanne: Yeah because I’m a total introvert. I only stay with what’s comfortable. I always hung out with Korean-Americans like myself all through high school and college because I have gone to all these schools where there are a lot of Koreans. I mostly [00:29:37] Koreans among my friends and at church, too. I only attended Korean churches. My community was very small, and I was always with just the Koreans. I would only speak with classmates at school and hang out with Koreans – my Korean friends outside of school. That still is like that even with my life here, because besides work, I go to Korean church and I attend the English side, but it’s all Korean people, so mostly Korean. I feel like I just stay with a very small community.
Ben: What about the landscape or the city or the food, for instance, or anything that isn’t people related? How did you acclimatize to those aspects of American life when you first moved here?
Maryanne: Back in Korea nowadays, you can find everything, all kinds of diversity and food and culture, everything. You’ll find it in Korea faster than you find it here about fashion and everything, like pop culture. When I was growing up, everything was – like even finding cheese, because I remember my cousin came and he wanted cheese and we couldn’t find cheese for him because cheese in American food wasn’t that common. We had to go to this very specialty store to get American goods or ingredients. Nowadays, you can easily find it in any market, but back then, it was very rare and everything was very expensive. I remember bananas was the most expensive fruit when I was growing up. Nowadays, it’s not, but back then, it was so expensive. One banana will cost like $2 to $3, and you rarely ever eat bananas. I remember coming to America and we would eat bananas all the time because it was so expensive in Korea. It was the cheapest fruit here or one of the cheapest fruits. I remember banana was so cheap and so delicious. Now, I’m sick of it, but I remember eating bananas was such a joy.
What else? The culture thing? Then pizza was very rare. I think maybe I had pizza only a handful of times living in Korea because there weren’t too many pizza restaurants back then. Coming here, eating pizza. I’m not a big on beef, but my brothers and my sister, they went nuts with McDonald’s, their burgers and everything. That was my thing. We were just happy to eat all these westernized foods. It was not readily available back in Korea when we were living.
Ben: How did you and your family, if at all – how did your Korean heritage – how was it maintained by your family through food, clothing, other traditions, just in that ancillary circle while you were adjusting to life outside your family? What was maintained within your family from Korea to the US consistently?
Maryanne: Main event is that my dad was big on New Year’s Day that we all wear our traditional Korean outfit called hanbok. We had to bow to our parents, and then we will have to kneel and sit. Then my dad will start saying, oh, I bless you for this, this, for this year, I wish – he will share what his hope was for each child going from oldest to the youngest. Everything is from the oldest to youngest. In Korean culture, you always respect the oldest. Then my oldest sister will bow first and she’ll kneel and my dad will give his blessing and my mom will give her blessing to my sister about new wishes, the wishes for the new year, and things like that. Then my older brother will go and then my other brother will go and then I go last. Then they’ll always give us new year’s money. That’s tradition in Korea, but my dad kept that every year. Even when my daughter was born, when we were visiting him in Chicago where they’re living, we would always have to prepare our clothes for New Year’s and then we’ll bow and things like that. He kept that tradition. Of course, eating as a family, my dad would always make sure we’re all well fed. Even visiting him, he’ll always make sure we were all fed and always had food, and we would always eat together as a family. Yeah, my dad kept that tradition.
Ben: Moving on from your childhood to more of your young adult years, maybe during college and after college, how has your understanding of Korean culture evolved since your childhood and related to your family that you have now? How do you pass down these traditions to the next generation, if applicable?
Maryanne: I mean, my kids grow up eating a lot of Korean food. I make them nutritious food and I find Korean food more nutritious because there’s not much of a – a lot of Asians are like lactose intolerant, so I can’t tolerate dairy. I try to make my kids eat more vegan and variety of vegetables. I put my effort feeding my kids a well-balanced Korean diet when they were younger. Now that they’re teens, they don’t always enjoy my cooking and they prefer more American food than my cooking. Still, every week, I make sure I make Korean food, like Korean soup and Korean stews and meat dishes so that my husband and I can always have Korean food. We’re all Korean. My husband’s also Korean. I still keep a lot of Korean food at home and I still enjoy eating Korean food more than anything else. I keep that tradition. Also, respecting the grandparents when they come and visit. My daughter is away in Tennessee, so when she comes home, we make sure that we go visit grandparents to say hi and have a meal together. I emphasize about respecting grandparents and parents.
Ben: Awesome, more on your life as an adult, how did you and your husband meet?
Maryanne: We were introduced by my pastor’s wife. We just started talking on the phone. We exchanged phone numbers. She had us exchange phone numbers. My husband called me because my husband’s parents wanted my husband to meet a Korean person. I think he did also prefer Korean person, but he grew up here in Orlando where there’s not many Korean population. He gave me a call and then we started talking and we got along really well over the phone. He decided to come and see me, visit me on a long weekend. We spent one weekend together and we had a lot in common. Yeah, it led to another. We got engaged year after we started talking and got married a year and a half later. Because the Korean community is very small, and then also, we’re Seventh Day Adventist, which is a very minor Christian denomination. To be Korean Seventh Day Adventist, our circle’s very small, so we were introduced that way.
Ben: Beautiful, so was the move yourself to Florida to be with him or did you do that on your own accord, so to speak?
Maryanne: Yeah, I mean, he had a better job and he was going to be the breadwinner and we’re very traditional. My husband and I, we are very conservative. I feel like the women had to make the sacrifice and he had a more professional job. He went to graduate school. He’s got his doctorate degree. I just had bachelor’s and my job couldn’t feed. If he had a family, he would be the one who had to be the breadwinner. I made the sacrifice and moved down here. Also, his parents insisted that I move down also. He respected that and I respected that. I was more the adventurous one, so I was getting tired of living in Midwest. I wanted to try out different lifestyle, like to be in Florida. I thought that was fun. I made the sacrifice and I moved here.
Ben: What caused you to be tired of the American Midwest?
Maryanne: I’ve been there since ’87. Went to school in Wisconsin in ’94 to ’98. Could be my personality, but I really did not like the gloomy weather, because six months out of the year is always cold and it’s gloomy, and I would feel depressed and lonely. I did not like that weather. I thought, yeah, it just that the weather affects me a lot.
Ben: It was time for a change?
Maryanne: Yeah, I was getting tired of just – Korean tradition is that if you move away for college and then if you are not on your own, you usually move back home until you’re married. You move back home and you live with your parents until you get married. For me, I got a job near where my parents lived, so I lived with my parents. Once you had that freedom for four years being away and then being back home, it just wasn’t the same. I really wanted to have my own place. Until I get married, I wasn’t really allowed to move out. Unless I had a really good promotion, like out of state and had a fabulous job, then, of course, then I’m sure my parents will allow me. At one point I was going to move to New York because my friend moved out there and she really liked it. She asked me to move out, but I didn’t have a job secured. My parents were like, no, not a good idea. You stay where you are until you get married, then you move out. I think that’s the Korean culture and it’s not to be embarrassed to move back home with their parents. I did that and I was ready to just move out of my parents’ house and have my own place. I thought, oh, moving to Florida would be really fun.
Ben: When, during the process of your marriage, did you move to Florida? Was it after you had already met, after you were engaged or after you were already married?
Maryanne: After we were engaged. We got engaged in May and then we set our wedding date for September. I moved here in July because my husband already had bought a – he was living with his parents too and he did not like that, because he was already working, making great money, but his parents will not let him move out. He actually secretly signed an apartment lease to move out to live on his own, near his parents’ house because he was working near in the same city that his parents lived. His parents made him break the lease and paid a penalty and still had to live at home. He was 28, 29, making six figure income, still living with his parents because they’re very traditional as well and he respected that. He listened to his parents. When we were ready to get married, he bought a place near his parents’ house. I moved down here early. I was living in his place and he was still living with his parents. Then close to our wedding date, we were able to move in together.
Ben: How soon after getting married and at what age did you have your first child with him?
Maryanne: I got married when I was 25 and my husband was 29. Then a month later, I turned 26 and he became 30 – two months after we got married. I got married 2001, and then I had my first child in 2003 December. It took us like a year and three months until she was born.
Ben: How many children do you have now?
Maryanne: I have two.
Ben: How far apart are they in age?
Maryanne: They’re three years and three months apart.
Ben: As they were growing up, could you reflect on the elements of Korean tradition and American lifestyle that you chose to either implement or not expose your children to during their own childhoods?
Maryanne: My kids only hung out with cousins because they had three cousins close to their age. They spent most of their free time with their cousins because I didn’t have a lot of friends here because after I moved here, I worked a little bit, but I didn’t continue to work. My community was the Korean church that I still attend until this day. Then a few friends from church. Then my sister-in-law also had moved here from New Jersey because her husband had a job here, so she was like in my case too. She had moved here. She and I spent a lot of time together and our cliques were close in age. We did a lot of things together. Then also, my daughter would do music classes and gymnastic classes growing up, and then we’ll have all these people in the class. I did not have close relationship outside of like church and family. My kids until school age, they hung out a lot with their just church families and actual families.
Ben: During their childhood, was there a strong Korean American presence at the time where you lived?
Maryanne: Yes, because the church was Korean American church. Then we also attended American church. Then I tried to expose my kids to American culture, American church and everything. When my daughter started first grade, she said, “Mom, I no longer want to go to American church. I want to just stay where grandparents attend. I like this church better.” We made a full-time transition to the Korean church. Even though she went to kindergarten full-time and she had friends who were all American friends and all her friends were Americans, she still felt more comfortable with Asians or Koreans. I sense that even early on that she feels closer to the Koreans.
Ben: During their childhoods and their educations in America, could you sense as their mother any challenges that they were having or successes that they were having culturally and socially fitting in with other children that were not Korean and if there are any memories of that, if you could detail those for me, please?
Maryanne: Sure, the funny story is that my daughter started doing play dates when she was 18 months old. I tried to speak mostly Korean to her. Actually, I think I spoke only Korean to her until then because I wanted to make sure that she learned how to speak Korean and understand Korean. I think I took on that responsibility because my husband came here when he was only six, so his Korean is not so perfect. He’s more comfortable in English and I’m more comfortable in Korean, because we only spoke Korean at home growing up, when I was growing up. I spoke more Korean than English, I think my whole life. I tried to teach – my role was to make sure my kids knew Korean. I only spoke Korean to her. Then starting 18 months, when she was 18 months old, we started doing play dates and she noticed that everyone was calling their mom, mommy. She would always call me mom in Korean which is Umma. All of a sudden, I didn’t tell her to change or anything, but she started calling me mama. I thought that was funny that she never went back calling me Umma ever again. She always called me mama. I thought that was funny.
What is it? Then I had to start speaking English half and half when I’m out in public. Because I homeschooled my children, I taught them Korean, but still everything I had to teach was all in English because I have to use American curriculum for math, English and everything. I think then we spoke mostly English at home. My kids don’t really speak Korean that well, but my daughter understands a lot, but she’s timid to speak because she has an accent when she speaks. My son has no clue what I’m saying in Korean. Whenever I say anything in Korean, he’s like, what? My daughter actually went to a school where there were no Koreans, hardly any Asians. Now she’s at a college where there’s a lot of Korean Americans like herself. Now she’s only hanging out with Korean Americans, I think, and she really likes it. She’s planning her grad school so that she can be with this Korean American community. I thought it was funny how she’s never hung out with Koreans all her life except her cousins, but at school was all her non-Korean friends mostly white friends, and now all her friends are like all Koreans. I thought that was funny.
She’s more interested in Korean culture and she regrets not learning Korean. Maybe in high school, she took Spanish for three years, but she regrets that she could’ve maybe take Korean classes and that her Korean could be a little better. A lot of the stuff that she watches as an entertainment is like all Korean stuff on Netflix thing. I thought that was funny because she did not like Korean K-pop. She did not want to do anything with Korean culture all through high school. People would ask her about BTS and she’d be like, no, I don’t like BTS. She had no interest in Korean pop culture. Now all she listens to is like Korean songs. I thought that was funny.
Ben: Yeah, so during your children’s childhoods, as a parent, what did you choose to keep or do away with as it relates to elements of your childhood and your traditions that you were accustomed to as a child? What did you choose to bring with you to your children to pass on and what did you choose to redact, if anything?
Maryanne: I think food was important to me. Then also, having meals together and worship. We would have family worships when they’re younger. Those things were valuable to me when I was growing up. Actually, family worship was not something I enjoyed, but I do have fond memories where we all prayed together and my dad would preach. I tried to do that. My kids did not really enjoy it, but we always had family worship. I don’t think that’s Korean culture. I think that’s more of something I enjoyed growing up that I wanted to instill in my children. We did that. Then I noticed that in American culture, sports are very emphasized in American culture. A lot of the young children start playing sports early on and they try all different sports. In Korea, when I was growing up, sports were something for kids that did not want to continue with education. They would play sports. Not so smart. I don’t know how to word this, but if you’re very intellectual and you’re very good at academics, then we don’t emphasize sports. I noticed that in American culture, you have to be good at sports, academic. You have to be well-rounded child. You want to raise your kids to be, I think, well-rounded. That’s my perception. I could be wrong, but I feel like you raise a kid to be a whole package, to be good at academics, to be good at community service, all of that. They look at the total package, but in Korea, if you did really well in school, that’s all it mattered.
Things can be different right now, but in getting into college, you only have a one chance to take the exam. If you don’t do well and you don’t get into the school you want, you have to study all over again for a whole year. That becomes the center. That’s your goal of your whole 12 years of school education is a preparation for that college entrance exam, and so you did not have time to play sports. Maybe early on in grade school, you do like TaeKwonDo or something, swimming, but not professionally like to compete in a competition. That was not really encouraged. I noticed that here in America, if you don’t play sports or you join like a band or you have to choose something extracurricular in order to fit in with the school and to have friends. To make friends in your circle of friends, you have to have things like that.
My kids started swimming in middle school. Oh my gosh! I really did not like the lifestyle because I was always on the go trying to take them to practice, pick them up and make sure they were fed. We’re like always eating on the go, going to swim meets. That was not something I grew up with because we’re the first-generation immigrant family. My parents didn’t know anything about American education. All they wanted us to get good grades, get into good school. We always helped out with our parents’ business, so we didn’t have time to play sports. Now that we’re the second generation, my kids have this opportunity to play sports. I’m staying home to raise kids. Yeah, I thought that was something that I’ve experienced that I found it very stressful, because that’s not something I grew up with. Just a lot of driving and competitions and swim meets and waiting. That was stressful for me.
Ben: As a little aside, I don’t know if you know this about me, but I swim with Nano myself, and I can very strongly relate to everything you’re saying about growing up as a swimmer and that lifestyle and everything like that.
Maryanne: Yeah, that becomes the center of our whole family is like, if they play sports, it’s like your whole weekend is tied up with sports and sport events and things like that when they’re in season.
Ben: Definitely.
Maryanne: Yeah, Nano and Kirsten grew up together. They went to school together. They’ve known each other since Nano was 13 months old and Kirsten was 18 months old and they’ve gone to school together all their life. I don’t know if you knew that.
Ben: Yeah, it’s great that you’re telling.
Ben: On that theme, it seems to me like you did not play sports as a child, and that was an – I don’t want to say uncommon thing in Korea. If it was, how did you as a child spend your playtime? What did you do for fun activities? What are some of your memories of your Korean play experience?
Maryanne: When I was growing up in Korea, we did not push our children to play sports. It was luxury. I remember my brother played baseball and he had a baseball team. I remember that, but I think it’s because he really loved playing baseball. Other than that, none of our other siblings ever played any sports, and it was never encouraged. It was very common for a lot of the girls, a lot of Asians, still this day I encounter that, that a lot of the people don’t know how to swim. Even my generation that had come from Korea, they’re scared of water. I get scared of water too, because I almost drowned in a pool when I was younger in a creek one time. I had a fear of water. Because I lived in Seoul, in the city, we didn’t go to beach. We didn’t always go to the beach. I remember when I was younger, I hated feeling that touch of sand and the ocean wave would always scare me. I had this phobia of water. That was so common. I see people my age, not that the ladies my age don’t know how to swim, who are Korean, that’s pretty common.
I didn’t want to raise my kids that way because their life is going to be in America. They’re not going to Korea. They’re not going to fit in. I wanted them to make sure that they learn how to swim, especially in Florida where everybody has a pool. I taught them early on how to swim. I tried to expose a lot of things, even how to ride a bike. I know people who don’t even know how to ride a bike my age because they never learned how to ride a bike in Korea. If they grew up in Korea, in my age group, a lot of people don’t know how to – but because I had older brothers, I learned how to ride a bike and all that. There were a lot of limitations on like sports. Anyway, growing up our playtime was like – since I lived in an apartment, so we had a parking lot. In the parking lot, the lines for each car lot, we’ll play some games there. Everyone will stay on the line and you have to go to each box, the little rectangle for the car lot, we’ll have to pass, and if the person on the line touches you, then you have to go back to the first box and then go all the way up and pass each line of the offensive team, whatever you call it. We’ll play that until it was dinner time. Then when the parents are calling you for dinner time, then we’ll all just go one by one and go home.
Then we’ll play – I don’t know if you ever watched Squid game, but a lot of those games they play or the plays that we used to play. A lot of marbles – I didn’t play with marbles, but a lot of the boys played with marbles. Then there’s thing where you fold a paper, they usually use the thick paper. Usually in Korea, a lot of people hang their calendars on the wall and they use big thick – it’s a pretty big calendar. They’ll fold that or newspaper, they’ll fold that, and then you’ll fold it into some type of shape. Then you will hit the other paper, fold the paper like that and it flips over, you win. I don’t know how to play the game, but they mentioned that in Squid game. A lot of the guys will play games like that.
My favorite game was where we took the long elastic rubber band, and two people will hold each one each side and make it expand, and we’ll start from their ankle. They will loop it around their ankles. Two people will expand that, and then we’ll go in and we’ll sing a song and do all these steps and jumping and all that with that tripping. Then you move on and then the height of the rubber band will go to the knee height, and then you do the same thing. Then if you pass it, you can complete all these steps without tripping or getting caught or anything. Then you move on to the hips. Then it gets higher and higher. Then it’s called [01:04:06]. That was my most favorite play in my childhood. I would just practice putting the long elastic band around a light pole or something if there’s no one there. You need three people to do it because you need to have two people hold the elastic band and then the one person will do all that singing and stepping and all that jumping in the middle. Then if we didn’t have three, then we’ll use a chair or we’ll use a light pole or something. Then one person will hold elastic and then one person will do all the dancing and stepping and all that in the middle. That was very popular.
Then paper dolls were very popular. We’ll go to a place called Mumbangu, which is a stationery store where they keep all their school supplies and it’s a little stationery shop that they would always have it near school entrance. Then we’ll go and then they’ll sell little toys, some snacks, and they’ll sell all the school supplies that you need. Then we bought those as needed. Not like here, we don’t get a list of school supplies you need for the year. We just buy them as needed or requested by the teacher. Then we’ll just make a stop there and buy it on the way to school. They’ll sell little toys. My favorite thing to collect was collecting paper dolls and cutting those out and putting clothes on and playing with my friends. I’ll collect shoe boxes and boxes of those and just have a collection of my own.
Ben: When you were playing these games and engaging in these activities in your childhood, would these be friends from school or people from near where you lived? How did you meet these friends?
Maryanne: Usually in Korea, you walk to school, there’s no school bus, unless you went to really nice private school, they would have school buses, but that was very rare. Most of us will just walk to school. Yeah, mostly neighborhood friends were your school friends too.
Ben: You mentioned Squid Game and how you saw the games that you played as a child sometimes appear in this very American mainstream show. Where else have you seen aspects of your Korean childhood or Korea in general in the American mainstream in ways that we might not expect?
Maryanne: I watched this one Korean drama on Netflix. It’s called Reply 1988. That drama depicted, oh my god, my childhood. Everything they did is like total replica of what I grew up with. I thought that show was so well made. I knew it before it became very popular, but I didn’t watch it until recently and I could see why it became so popular in Korea because it brings back all the old memories of your childhood. They have series like that, like it’s called Reply 1988, and there’s Reply 1994. There’s a series of three like that. And then 1988 one is where they talked about Korean Olympics and all that. I thought that was funny. I wonder if American people watch it and they get it because it’s just so Korean.
Ben: It’s very cool that they could be exposed to things that they otherwise would probably have no idea about. Aspects from a place that they’re not familiar with and seeing that on a very accessible platform like Netflix. That seems like something that would be super cool to watch.
Maryanne: Yeah, it’s amazing how all these Korean dramas and Korean movies and all these things are on Netflix these days. Amazes me.
Ben: Yeah, well, Maryanne, that wraps it up for me on my end. Any final thoughts?
Maryanne: I hope I was able to give you a depth of my childhood.
Ben: You did an amazing job. I really want to thank you for agreeing to this interview with me and to submit your story to the Colby College Korean Oral History Project. Thank you so much.
Maryanne: All right, thank you.